tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post2829972328278021167..comments2024-03-27T21:23:40.339-04:00Comments on Chemjobber: I don't think that's quite right, Comrade PhysioprofChemjobberhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15932113680515602275noreply@blogger.comBlogger19125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-74588949607512716312012-04-28T11:52:01.561-04:002012-04-28T11:52:01.561-04:00"Note: Data are for persons age 25 and over. ..."Note: Data are for persons age 25 and over. Earnings are for full-time wage and salary workers."Technically Furloughednoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-62473959040772675772012-04-26T09:46:49.053-04:002012-04-26T09:46:49.053-04:00Hmmm -- seems like quality isn't the factor, b...Hmmm -- seems like quality isn't the factor, but price (or price/quality) is.Chemjobberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15932113680515602275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-1449194381037543302012-04-26T08:17:09.005-04:002012-04-26T08:17:09.005-04:00CJ, yes, I am saying that the quality of the Ph.D....CJ, yes, I am saying that the quality of the Ph.D. can change. The caveat is that quality is in the eye of the beholder. What seems "low" quality to some (companies wondering if they need to hire more technical staff) may seem like high quality to another (professors looking for another post-doc?).Curt F.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-71789016569749017122012-04-25T14:26:51.201-04:002012-04-25T14:26:51.201-04:00I'm a Ph.D chemist and also a banjo player who...I'm a Ph.D chemist and also a banjo player who has done research in polymers. Tell that HR rep they just found their matchAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-745476756423024042012-04-25T13:50:24.930-04:002012-04-25T13:50:24.930-04:00Right now it seems like industry can hire from the...Right now it seems like industry can hire from the glut of laid-off PhDs that previously held those jobs, so why would they bother to train fresh PhDs? No amount of academic experience is going to compare to someone who had X years of experience in that exact position they are hiring for.<br /><br />Say graduate programs did catch on and begins producing the perfect candidates. What then happens to all those laid-off PhDs waiting in the wings? The problem still exists, just at a different level.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-80109818020264203482012-04-25T08:57:23.496-04:002012-04-25T08:57:23.496-04:00Of course there are unfilled positions - some HR j...Of course there are unfilled positions - some HR jerk demands an individual with exactly 3-5 years experience formulating polymers for banjo strings, and trashes any resume that doesn't fit exactly!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-65153049055834665442012-04-25T06:35:33.252-04:002012-04-25T06:35:33.252-04:00There is clearly a disconnect (at least in organic...There is clearly a disconnect (at least in organic chem) between what PhDs are taught and what industry needs them to know. Over the years, industry has increasingly hired for the aptitude and ignored the attitude. Where many moons ago they would hire the person and train for the job.Milohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06753588919496192713noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-10464125974942335002012-04-25T00:42:40.345-04:002012-04-25T00:42:40.345-04:00So what you're arguing, perhaps, is that we...So what you're arguing, perhaps, is that we're producing too many low-quality PhDs?Chemjobberhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15932113680515602275noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-48059311560853213472012-04-24T20:50:44.395-04:002012-04-24T20:50:44.395-04:00Couching the debate in terms of an overproduction ...Couching the debate in terms of an overproduction of "PhDs" is part of the problem. A PhD is not a commodity like steel or maize. The nature of the PhD can change. What's taught in the curriculum can change. The way in which research contributions are made and valued can change. Maybe the problem isn't that we are producing too many PhDs. Maybe we're producing exactly the right amount, but the content of the knowledge transferred to most PhDs through their doctoral studies that is not optimal.Curt F.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-3623024658588488142012-04-24T20:49:04.373-04:002012-04-24T20:49:04.373-04:00Professors and universities should have to report ...Professors and universities should have to report on employment status of their students a year after graduation. It would indirectly measure whether the professor is career mentoring his/her students and whether the research area is one that has jobs available. This would help students when they are deciding which research group to join in graduate school. <br /><br />If employment rates could also be a factor in tenure discussions, grant renewals, and the ACS rankings of chemistry departments that would be even better. Students would need to research and include this information as part of their decision process, but at least the data would be available.Markhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06952310772166262878noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-68536364813689204562012-04-24T16:02:42.387-04:002012-04-24T16:02:42.387-04:00That's one of the more eloquent things Comrade...That's one of the more eloquent things Comrade PhysioProf has said. Usually you have to minutely examine his comments for the occasional non-swear word. He might actually win the prize for the most potty-mouthed academic around if his arguments also had some substance in them.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-43950714178529806472012-04-24T14:17:46.780-04:002012-04-24T14:17:46.780-04:00My point is that those positions will immediately ...My point is that those positions will immediately have many applicants causing there to be no apparent shortage within a day, if not hours.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-26416985063991045222012-04-24T14:08:26.752-04:002012-04-24T14:08:26.752-04:00Can we make a rule? Anyone who claims a shortage/u...Can we make a rule? Anyone who claims a shortage/underproduction of scientists must have at least five unfilled positions they can point us too to prove it. Now we'll see....bwahahaAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-15244262039595758422012-04-24T13:51:22.938-04:002012-04-24T13:51:22.938-04:00No, those are professional degrees, which pay more...No, those are professional degrees, which pay more and have an even lower unemployment rate, according to the BLS.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-91384152706507022852012-04-24T13:32:43.129-04:002012-04-24T13:32:43.129-04:00Are JD's, MD's, and PharmD's included ...Are JD's, MD's, and PharmD's included into the "doctoral" data?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-14030546974304254942012-04-24T13:04:30.251-04:002012-04-24T13:04:30.251-04:00The unemployment rate for PhD's is 2.5%? I gu...The unemployment rate for PhD's is 2.5%? I guess all those chemists who got Pfizered or Dow-sized must be imagining things!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-68920231147442525142012-04-24T13:03:18.463-04:002012-04-24T13:03:18.463-04:00At the bottom of that BLS chart, it states, "...At the bottom of that BLS chart, it states, "earnings are for full-time wage and salary workers".<br /><br />Given the low percentage of the population with a PhD, and the ample opportunities to exploit PhD scientists in part-time, temporary, postdoctoral, consulting, adjunct, etc. positions, I'm not surprised that the BLS comes up with a low "unemployment" rate, but a high salary. I'd estimate a significant percentage of PhDs, especially fresh graduates, are stuck in these types of positions that don't get counted in either wages or unemployment. The ACS does the same thing with their numbers.<br /><br />I graduated with a PhD four years ago from a program in the top 50 of the US news and review rankings. Of the 30 something people I graduated with who I am still in contact with, not a single one has a "full time" job. They are either adjuncts, visiting professors, postdocs, or law students. When these opportunities start to dry up (how many years can the postdoc pool keep absorbing all the graduates?) we will see massive PhD unemployment and wages that fall like a rock.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-1384324955660845652012-04-24T12:10:22.318-04:002012-04-24T12:10:22.318-04:00"There is a big fucken snivel-fest going on....."There is a big fucken snivel-fest going on..."<br /><br />That's an excellent writing style to convince people of your point. I'll try that next time I publish an article. It's certainly easier than generating a well-thought out argument.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8964719845369935777.post-7181752216675021462012-04-24T12:02:43.202-04:002012-04-24T12:02:43.202-04:00Expect to see more of this whining from academia a...Expect to see more of this whining from academia as their cheap labor pool begins to realize how they've been lied to for ten years and ACS lobbying is no longer able to drown it out with STEM shortage slogans.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com